Good Hip-Hop Vs Wack Hip-Hop

So you all know that Ice T made some comments to Soulja Boy then Soulja Retorted then Ice-T apologized for saying "Eat a Dick" and "Talking Down" To A Child. Then he summed up his retraction by saying "This is not a east Vs west north Vs south this is a matter of Good hip-hop Vs Wack Hip-Hop"

He went on to say how he respects artist like "Jeezy, Lupe Fiasco and Ludacris"

My question is what do you consider good hip-hop. Does it have to tell a story? Does it have to "mean" something is it suppose to make you dance? What is good hip-hop?

Where do we draw the line at "Being creative and Original" To your shit just being "TRASH"

I Respect what Ice T had to say. And I respect him being man enough to apologize for being ignorant but stand strong on his point. I disagree with him saying Soulja Boy should have just taken that from him. This is why and I know a lot of you guys will disagree but it is what it is.

Since I started listening to music one of the things that I liked the most about Hip-Hop is that you could be original. Rappers like Missy Elliot Andre 3000 Busta Rhymes ODB and Redman none of these artist are conventional emcees and they all came out with their own thing.

I feel like that is being true to your art, I feel like doing you is the most important part of this hip-hop thing. Because beyond the beats and rhymes beyond the image it is a lifestyle. Something we live and we are truly about and what you say in your rhymes and what you act out in your videos are suppose to be reflections of you as a human so if a person comes out kicking some shit im not feeling okay im not feeling them and what they are about but does that make them trash?

A lot of emcees come out with trash I can name just about every rapper great or not that has dropped some bullshit and we let it ride cause "they can rap" or "they from the streets thats a real ----- there."

But then a kid like Soulja boy comes in the game and completely changes it. Everybody jumps on his movement and ready to be on his team and he is destroying a whole 30 some odd years of hip-hop? Id have to say he isn't what is killing hip-hop.

Its the haters, its the politics its too much anaylizing going on of the music. Its record companies demanding pop records out of emcees. It is disloyal hip-hop listeners it is DJ's program directors at radio. It is a bunch of things that come in to play when you talk about Hip-hop and its purity in this day and age.

I will always believe good hip-hop is from the heart. When I see you perform live on stage and you mean it. When you rocking your rhymes like its just you and your mic.

Wack hip-hop is when people are put out there just because. When their is no love in it. When they are just doing it for the money, when they do not care. And if Soulja Boy is in it for the money then fuck him may he rott somewhere still breathing. But if this is really him, if this is what he dreamed of doing and what he feels in his heart then you go lil ----- get ya money.

And thats it to me in the war of good hip-hop Vs Bad hip-hop it comes down to your heart and how you really feel about the music.

Soulja boy didn't kill hiphop, but he isn't do anything good for it. Wack is something that doesn't have a hot beat, and lacks creativity...a lot of this Auto tune bullshit is wack to me because it's just riding on something someone else did without expanding without bringing something new in the least. To me, every song I've heard from soulja boy has been WACK to me. The beats sucked, the hooks sucked, the lyrics were trash, and everything sounded the same on his album. That is wack to me and since that's all he's put out I would consider him wack. I would agree that even artists I consider ill or dope put out shit that I'm not feeling and I could consider wack, but that's not the only thing they put out so I don't let one or a few songs change my view on them.

Until soulja boy does music that feel is good...with hot beats and decent hooks at least some okay quotable lyrics, he'll be wack to me

I see and interesting discussion in the making

but let me bring my opinons to the table

I have mixed and multiple opinions on this but i will say first and foremost:
THERE IS NO GOOD HIP-HOP OR WACK HIP-HOP.....Hip-Hop is Hip-Hop. Period. Now there are different categories and sub genres and such but good or wack hip-hop is only a matter of opinon. And if you wanna get on an educational opinions arent facts. Prove to me a song is good or prove to me a song is wack....you can't because its only opinion...so as long as there are people in the world there is always gonna be someone who thinks its "good" and someone who thinks is "wack". Plain and simple

Now as for the soulja ice tea thing....Its definatley contriversial in the hip hop world once fans discuss it but heres what I think and feel. I generally agree with ef...not 100% but she brings valid points and so did everyone else in the other thread. Before I contunue i will add that I am not a fan of soulja boy's music nor do i listen to it nor do i plan on...but how can you credit him for single handedly destroying hip-hop. First of all...take a look around you....hip-hop isn't destroyed, dead or any variation of such. Hip-Hop is alive and breathing well. Now the sales arent like they used to and thats the only problem I see. But how is Hip-Hop dead when you cant go anywhere without seeing or hearing something affiliated with the culture...EVERY movie or television show that I have seen in the past few years have something "Hip-Hop" shown, played, or referanced in it. Every place in the country has been affected by it....urban or suburban. And it knows no racial boundries...I know black, white, hispanic, asian, indian, german, and all different types of people who love hip-hop and consider themselves hip-hop. So you'd pretty much have to be under a rock to say hip-hop is dead, dying destroyed or whatever. The only thing lacking in hip-hop is the sales because of different factors but there is no need to discuss that in this thread.

Now...with that being said...Who's to say Soulja Boy is or isn't hip-hop? What is hip-hop? Hip-Hop has many definitions much like the word "love", there isn't one defining characteristic of hip hop...in demeanor or music. People started saying he wasn't hip-hop when they was hating on him....they put that label on him. He might call himself a rapper now...but the 1st people I heard label him as a MC or hip-hopper was people hating on him saying he wasn't. But I think (just an opinion) he is very much hip-hop...for one reason...he's true to himself in his music...you got all these fake fraudulent ass -----s in the game and people saying they hip-hop when they music don't represent them as a person. When remy was on trial she told the judge that she wasnt the person she rapped about in her music...that was an "image" created by labels. Its a sad day when a rapper...singer or musicion can't be themselves. I think SouljaBoyTellEm is more Hip-Hop than the rest of these dudes with they fabricated bars.
Why cant the lil ----- make a dance track to have fun on.....how you know he's not lyrical...the ----- prolly got bars on him...maybe that aint his style....who cares that ain't my point. My point is just because he's no Jay-Z, no Rakim, or no Tupac...doesn't make him less Hip-Hop.

Not to mention what ef said..hes payin bills....why -----s always want you to make it wen u broke but when u doin it big....all of a sudden you doin something wrong? there is something very wrong with that picture.....LET THAT LIL ANNOYING MUFUCKA COLLECT HIS CHECKS....if you mad he made money off somethin stupid....Why don'y you get up off the computer and make yo money...otherwise keep it movin

Everyone who knows me knows i hate soulja boy's music with a passion./...but he's in a much better position than i am soo wat good is it for me to complain about it....like he said in the vid...-----s should be congratulatin him....Congrats lil -----...you sell out shows, you get the club poppin...you lill -----s an lil bitches movin they ass....you makin money...I respect that...he grindin and i cant knock another ----- hustle...expecially when i ain't got nothin 2 show from my own

Ice T is completley wrong in that 1st vid....I've yet 2 see the second vid he did so o cant offer a comment on that yet....but he (imo) isn't that much of a pioneer as other older hip-hop heads.....how would the game be different if he never exsisted? [gives time 2 answer]

exactly.....I'm from the east coast.....I cant really speak for other areas....but hes not relevant.....you can stop anyone on the streets over here and ask them to name 3 icet songs....you might get 1...but i highly doubt it....-----s can name 3 soulja boy songs tho....

No disrespect to no one an they opinions but soulja boy ain't really doin nothing wrong

Will i listen 2 him....no
will i buy his album....no
do i like his music....no

But hey i can't say he's not hip-hop [although i used to...but i've went through a recent change of mind]

I'm not a big fan of Biggie or Pac...does that make them less hip-hop or wack/...no...i just dont preferr they shit...simple as that

If you dont preferr something it doesnt make it bad or destructive.....jus move on and stop puttin your mind and energy toward it u feel me

personally every region has good hip hop and wack hip hop. Cant blame the south. For every Scarface and Bun B we have a lil *insert generic rap name here*. There is always good music around you just gotta find it but people who make generic songs just to sell ringtones are well wack. They use "THE HOOD N---A!!!" to sell among other things

Quote:

Originally Posted by Young Ef Wack hip-hop is when people are put out there just because. When their is no love in it. When they are just doing it for the money, when they do not care. And if Soulja Boy is in it for the money then fuck him may he rott somewhere still breathing. But if this is really him, if this is what he dreamed of doing and what he feels in his heart then you go lil ----- get ya money. And thats it to me in the war of good hip-hop Vs Bad hip-hop it comes down to your heart and how you really feel about the music.

look at that image. album covers ALWAYS reflect on the artist. and look at him. all he's doing is holding his chain in one hand and pointing at the camera. this shows that he cares about materialism and he's braggin about it. so basically, ALL HE DOES CARE ABOUT IS MONEY, so......i guess he should rot somewhere as u say.
also, it's like he doesnt care about anything besides the money becuz of the fact he doesnt care what the cover looks like...he juss wears a white hat, sunglasses, and a white tall tee. it gives such a BLANK first impression.
i mean yeah some otehr album covers are wack too.. but they have meanign behind it. like the new plies one...he's juss crouching down, sagging his pants with a ski mask on. u know the meaning behind that.

LMAO!! you serious? you are going to use an album cover that gets photo shopped as your argument as to what this boy is about? I thought you would have a youtube a comment something

but an album cover? okay so answer me this



what does this cover mean? does this mean the roots agree with hanging -----s?

hahaha

[sits back and waits 4 response]

Where to start........

Hip Hop was born from expression, as an art it's one of the most creative forms of expression ever conceived, as the years go by i see that raw energy becoming a fad that people fuel by buying, it's a cycle in the sense that many many people buy it so that they can be a part of that fad, in turn even more want to jump aboard so that they can be popular as well.

I refuse to believe that people enjoy that type of bullshit, i think that people use it as a type of social status and only listen to it so that the next person will think they are "Cool", why else would they blare it so loud when they ride?, why else would they listen to it so loudly that their entire car vibrates and distorts the sound? it damn sure aint for their own enjoyment...That's how you can tell who really enjoys rap, their the ones who play it for themselves and don't give a fuck who overhears what they listen to.

If you ask me what makes good music this is what i think:

For it to be considered real music, it must mean something or be artistic, it HAS to be something you do for yourself, sure, the goal is money but it also has to be something that you do as good as you can, look at that Luda song "Runaway love", it's not that good of a song but he came from the heart with it, it was about something that matters and he put everything he had into it, therefor i consider it real music. Now look at "Chain Hang Low" by Jibbs, what the fuck is that shit? look at "Crank that" and the million other wack ass tracks like that, they are the ones who have nothing to say and they are the ones who can't even bring themselves to make an effort, in a way they are smart because they know that people will eat that shit up so they feel no need to even try. what ever happened to trying to be the best? what the fuck happened to trying to put out music that people could relate to or music that could provoke thought?

I'm going to end this by saying something that i will get alot of hate over, Soulja boy didn't kill hip hop, The south killed it and then took a shit on it's body.

@Ef - It's actually showing (well at least in my opinion) the persecution that the African race has endured throughout history, whether it be in America, Africa, or elsewhere. The actual hanging figure is a representation for the oppression that African American's and African's abroad have had to overcome.

Now I wouldn't say that the South COMPLETELY killed the Hip-Hop culture but it had an important role in the deed. I think that the culture started to decline with the many Rap deaths in the late 1990's (Tupac, Biggie, Big Pun, Big L, et cetera) and the Atlanta music (which I like to refer to it as) came in and finished it off with a series of "hits" by Lil' Jon.

That's just me tho.

ima keep it short .. hiphop is art .. and art is perspective .. sometimes , only a certain amount of people like what someone does .. and others wont .

and smh at people saying south killed hiphop .. the change in music is inevitable , it happened in the 70s to the 80s and 80s to 90s .. and it'll keep happening . styles and fads change too .. just a while ago dudes was rocking the 5xtall tees [ night gown garments ] and now they rock the fitted tees [ titty tighteners ] . me and ghetto was having a chat about how style is changing . pretty soon the style is gonna change so much , well be like all the old people we know talking about "i remember back in my days" and all that bullshit .

and my final thoughts , i don't listen nor support most of the music today . i don't listen to the radio much anymore because i don't like the music that's on it .. and that's MY choice , just like if it's your choice to listen to it . can't knock you for what you like .. and you can't knock the dudes who getting money off the shit on the radio . let them get they money . to be honest i think most of the artist who say shit like that are just mad they ain't getting paid . haha , but hiphop is one thing .. and that's hiphop .. no good , or whack . it's all what you like .

Quote:

Originally Posted by Young Ef LMAO!! you serious? you are going to use an album cover that gets photo shopped as your argument as to what this boy is about? I thought you would have a youtube a comment something but an album cover? okay so answer me this what does this cover mean? does this mean the roots agree with hanging -----s?

what album covers arent photoshopped nowadays?
all of them are...

and if they believed in hanging...uhmm..a certain race of people then the person would be black, not the background of the hang man game
and im sure u noticed it looks like a hangman game painted on a newspaper article. that implies that theyre into current events. So they're kinda like "serious, conscious-political-rap" or something
and they put the hangman picture on the newspapers maybe to imply that
because of how the world is right now, innocent people are dying??

idk i never listened to the roots..so i wouldnt know but thats what i see when i look on the album cover..

exactly you dont no what tha roots are about but you just said that you can tell what a group is about based on an album cover see...be careful youngin

the rap music i enjoy is anything that can positively entertain me...meaning i found the track funny in a good way (where as im not laughing at the artist but with the artist) or i find it relaxing, or it hypes me up, or it makes me want to dance, or eh it makes me want to call a ex of mine up for some whatever whatever....lol as long as i enjoy it, it doesn't matter who made it

Quote:

Originally Posted by Young Ef exactly you dont no what tha roots are about but you just said that you can tell what a group is about based on an album cover see...be careful youngin

tell me, was i close???

The Roots are conscience hip-hop but it isn't beat your self up with a book type shit. They are most known for their lead rapper Black Thought and their drummer ?love i believe his name is i could be wrong but its somethin like that

and they music is basically da shit...one of they hit singles was You Got Me With Erkah Badu and Eve